I don’t know if John Hammond is paying attention, but after the Yi/RJ trade and the draft, the Bucks’ roster has some pretty big holes. Take a look and see if you know what I mean:
PG: Mo Williams, Ramon Sessions
SG: Michael Redd, Charlie Bell
SF: Richard Jefferson, Desmond Mason, Joe Alexander, Luc-Richard Mbah a Moute, Awvee Storey*
PF: Charlie Villanueva
C: Andrew Bogut, Dan Gadzuric
(*I’m not sure if Storey’s deal is guaranteed)
Am I the only person who thinks that a 12-man roster with three guys taller than 6′8″ is a problem? Especially when one of them is Danny G?
It’s not as though trading for a starting caliber power forward is going to be easy. There simply aren’t many of them out there. I wanted to write one of my “12 potential trades that won’t happen” columns, but it was impossible. I couldn’t really find any decent power forwards who the Bucks would want and who their current teams would be willing to give up. Mo Williams for Udonis Haslem? Mo and Charlie V for Chris Wilcox and Luke Ridnour? Gadzuric, Villanueva, Mason and a #1 for Elton Brand? Those are silly ideas. You could probably get a stopgap power forward from Sacramento, but do you really want one of Kenny Thomas, Shareef Abdur-Rahim, Mikki Moore or Shelden Williams?
Maybe Hammond is hoping that the Detroit fire sale starts soon. Mo, Mason and a #1 for Chauncey Billups and Amir Johnson or Mason, Villanueva and Bell for Rasheed Wallace would work but neither of those ideas sound like something that Joe Dumars would do.
The more I think about it, the more I think Hammond was taken by surprise in this draft. The Yi-Jefferson trade came out of nowhere, so it probably happened so close to the draft that the Bucks didn’t have much of a plan “B” beyond taking Alexander. Most likely, they made the Yi trade hoping that one of Kevin Love, Eric Gordon or Russell Westbrook would slide to them; but when the player to slip was Jerryd Bayless (who was supposed to go #4 or #6, so the Bucks had not worked him out) they didn’t know what to do.
So what does it all mean? Will Hammond be able to pull off something incredible or are we going to try the Bogut-Villanueva combo again, and hope that it works this time? I’m not really sure.
If the best they can do is sign Brian Skinner to be Villanueva’s backup, I’m going to be mighty upset.
Some other things of note:
Don’t forget that Ersan Ilyasova is still Bucks property. There’s no way they sign him and add him to this years’ roster since they don’t need a small forward, but he could be signed and traded.
Also, the final thing I am going to mention about Richard Hendrix (unless he turns out to be really good or gets released in training camp): according to Draft Express, his draft stock fell because of a knee injury that was uncovered at the predraft camp (despite his apparently playing well there). Draft Express points out that not only were Hendrix’s college numbers almost identical to Carlos Boozer’s, but Boozer also fell in the draft for the same reason.
If you are interested in the NBA Draft, I suggest donating to Draft Express. By making a donation, you will be able to view the site with no pop-up ads, which is well worth it.
11 responses so far ↓
1 smitty7789 // Jul 1, 2008 at 2:54 pm
I posted this over at Brewhoop.com
I would do this trade in a second, I think it would result in 15 more wins than our current roster. Anyway, here’s the post.
The Bucks need a power forward that plays defense, gets the rebounds, and basically, one that plays Scott Skiles’ ball. The other need the Bucks have is to get a more pure point guard. Looking at the Bucks from this angle, I looked at some other young and rebuilding teams around the league that might be willing to make a deal. I thought of some needs teams might have that also have a few good chips for the Bucks. Let’s start with the players involved in my three team deal that works under the ESPN trade machine
Memphis Grizzlies get:
SF- Desmond Mason
PF- Charlie Villanueva
PF/C- Mark Blount
Miami Heat get:
PG/SG- Marko Jaric
PG- Mo Williams
Milwaukee Bucks get:
PF- Udonis Haslem
PG- Mike Conley
SG- Greg Buckner
My Analyzation and why I think it’s a great trade for all teams:
Mainly, it provides all teams with position needs. Miami needs a point guard, Memphis needs big guys, and the Bucks need a pass-first defensive point guard like Conley and a bruising 4 like Haslem.
Memphis does gain a lot for giving up only Conley and Greg Buckner. Desmond Mason really is not a bad pick-up. Memphis really only gives up Mike Conley, whom they reportedly have been shopping since they already have a pleathera of nice young and cheaper point guards such as Kyle Lowry who really came on last season. Memphis and Miami basically swap bad contracts, although it is noted Blount’s contract does expire one year before Jaric’s, thus sweeting the deal for Memphis if only a little. Greg Buckner should never be considered not expendable but with the trade for O.J. Mayo, it seems the SG position is shored up.
Miami finally gets Mo Williams after reportedly coveting him for years. Losing Haslem does not hurt them as much as they just drafted Michael Beasley. Gaining Mo would allow them to package Jason Williams, Marcus Banks, or Marko Jaric’s amazing contract for a quality defensive center giving them a nice balance with Beasley at the 4 (I still don’t believe Beasley, at 6′7, will ever be a dominant power forward, but that’s another discussion). Miami also cuts 2 million in cap space with the Blount for Jaric swap.
Milwaukee gains a great young point guard who passes first and plays defense, something they lacked with Mo Williams. This allows Michael Redd, Richard Jefferson, and Bogut to get more shots and have a point guard to run the offense. Pairing Conley up with another 7 foot great young center again would be a fun sight. Udonis Haslem shores up any concerns regarding the 4 spot and provides defense, rebounding, and a tough mentality. All three of these were sorely lacking with Charlie V. This allows Alexander to come off the bench for Haslem or Jefferson and allows the Bucks to sub in Alexander once a team brings in one of their smaller power forwards. The loss of Desmond Mason would hurt the Bucks a little but we do cut cap space in this trade; not only this but with this trade I think we finally would see the transformation of the Bucks from a soft finnesse team to a tougher, defensive minded with offensive balance team, one that fits Scott Skiles’ playing style much better.
As for the reality of this deal happening, i honestly do not believe the trade is lopsided for any teams involved. I believe it works for all teams involved. Not only this, but it works with all of the players’ salaries factored in. I am interested to hear from Heat, Grizzlies, and Bucks fans and see if they would agree to a trade like this if they were the team’s manager. Please get on your phone now J Ham.
2 Brett Boyer // Jul 1, 2008 at 4:49 pm
Hey, who is writing this blog, anyway?
It’s a good idea, but I don’t think Memphis would part with Conley that easily. He was the #4 pick last year, and since Yi was worth Richard Jefferson then I’m sure the Griz would find Conley to be worth a lot more than this proposal.
Memphis is not shopping Conley. Just because they threw him in to a trade proposal to the Bulls for the #1 pick (which they knew all along the Bulls wouldn’t accept) doesn’t mean they are shopping him. He was hurt last season and played fairly well when he wasn’t.
Memphis might be interested for Kyle Lowry instead of Conley, but they don’t really need to do a deal. Remember that Memphis did also pick up Darrell Arthur in the draft, so they already have a power forward of the future in mind. It seems like the Grizz would cut cap room in the deal by losing Jaric and his 3 year deal (for Blount’s two years remaining) but that’s not really true since Charlie V is up for an extension after this season. So Memphis would either have to blow some of their cap room to extend Villanueva or else they would have made the trade for what amounts to a one year rental of a guy they hope isn’t a starter (since they have a cheaper replacement under contract for four years in Arthur), a guy they don’t need (Mason) and a guy they don’t want (Blount). Meanwhile, considering they are looking toward the future, Conley and Lowry as their point guards is about as good as they can do.
Of course, Chris Wallace is just about the dumbest GM in the league (I mean, he just got fleeced by Kevin McHale!) so I guess anything is possible.
3 smitty7789 // Jul 1, 2008 at 6:26 pm
Yeah I was sincerely wishing on the genius of Chris Wallace to make this trade happen. I’d still make the trade if Kyle Lowry was involved instead. Would you part ways with Mo and Charlie V for Kyle Lowry and Udonis Haslem straight up (if they both played for the same team and salaries matched)?
4 Brett Boyer // Jul 2, 2008 at 5:02 am
Mo for Haslem and then Charlie V for Lowry and Hakim Warrick would work under the cap.
It would be a huge risk. I think there’s a little “grass is greener” about Lowry vs. Mo. Being on Memphis, Lowry has never played a meaningful NBA minute in his life. He brings the same problem as Mo — he’s too small to play very good defense (although he gets a bunch of steals). He’s also a lousy shooter (42% last year, 36% his rookie year), while the big complaint about Mo is that his offense has become too good. I don’t buy the whole “shoot-first” vs. “pure” point guard thing — the Bucks’ coaches had no authority last season and Mo wasn’t the only guy doing whatever he wanted out there.
Ultimately, I don’t think that would be something the Bucks would do, since there isn’t much guarantee that Lowry is anything more than a worse offensive/equally bad defensive version of Mo. I think they would rather roll the dice on Mo improving under Skiles and seeing what they really have in Sessions. Hopefully next offsesaon they wind up with a TJ Ford/Jose Calderon situation — two guys who someone else around the league would want.
If not, then they draft Darren Collison in the late lottery next year.
5 Luke Uriniuk // Jul 2, 2008 at 10:05 am
I have heard that New York is looking to possibly trade David Lee… I think that would be an excellent fit for the Bucks, though I haven’t a clue as to what they would want in return. Mason, Villanueva, Gadzuric, *Storey & the idiotic #2 round selection the Bucks made are the only players I would like to see traded from this team. Mo Williams is a good player who i feel could still be a decent fit to this team if coached properly, but i would trade him too because of his lack of defense at the point. Maybe packaging them up, or atleast some of them, with a first round pick in order to get either a PG or PF that would fit this team better. If they can grap a PG and it works out to free up money then possibly they could go after say… Elton Brand in Free Agency in order to fill the PF need, though since Baron Davis seems to be signing with the Clippers then he’s probably going back to them.
I would also like to add that in responds to your comment… “The more I think about it, the more I think Hammond was taken by surprise in this draft. The Yi-Jefferson trade came out of nowhere, so it probably happened so close to the draft that the Bucks didn’t have much of a plan (B) beyond taking Alexander. ” …then why the hell did they make that second round selection when they knew already that the suprise trade caused them to be overloaded at SF with the Alexander pick. I understand that they are saying they feel that Alexander & perhaps even Mbah a Moute can play the 4 spot but that is a joke when playing some of the more dominate PFs in the league. I felt that if they wanted to take a flier on someone and it wasn’t going to be Richard Hendrix, due to whatever reasons they came up with, there was a big player with what I felt was potential in Nathan Jawai which could have helped give the Bucks a badly needed backup center. Plus, he was from Australia which might have made Bogut happy.
The way I would have liked to see the Bucks shaped out for this season:
PG: Mo Williams? / Ramon Sessions / (FA-Chris Duhon)
SG: Michael Redd / (FA-Fred Jones or Quinton Ross or Tony Allen)
SF: Richard Jefferson / Joe Alexander
PF: (Trade-David Lee) / (FA-James Jones)
C: Andrew Bogut / (Nathan Jawai)
This team is more than likely impossible to create, but there are some decent players out there that would be nice to have added to this team verses some of the garbage time players we have now (Danny G. & *Storey).
If we do end up keeping Villanueva & Mason, I sure hope to god that coach Skiles can drill it into Villanueva not to chuck up 3’s when ever he’s left open beyond it and draw up no offensive plays for Mason other than ally-oops. He should realize he’s a defense player only and lacks any ability to dribble and create or shoot.
6 swilldog // Jul 2, 2008 at 4:41 pm
Barring a major shocker of a trade, I don’t see the Bucks being able to get some decent frontcourt presence.
Maaaaybe a desperate, waiting-for-2010 team will be willing to give up someone middling for the Mo/V/Mason scraps along with a draft pick, but from where I sit you can go ahead an pencil Alexander in as the starting 4. Which would be a mistake, of course.
Right now we’re looking at no better than a 7th seed, done-in-4-games team — at best. The roster’s out of whack, and I really can’t imagine there are any more teams out there willing to do a trade the size it would take to balance out this roster. Given how surprised I was when the Yi trade went down I certainly could be wrong, but from where I sit we can look forward to at best a small move and some bench fodder.
7 Brett Boyer // Jul 2, 2008 at 6:42 pm
To get the 7th seed, the Bucks would probably have to win 43 games. That would represent a 17 win improvement over last season. If you figure Krystkowiak’s coaching cost them four last year and Skiles does an excellent job and steals four more this year, that is still nine more games that they have to win on talent. Getting the 7 seed would be a huge success this year.
Don’t start thinking that the Knicks are shopping David Lee — they are willing to part with him if someone else takes one of their deadweight contracts (Randolph or Curry) as well and gives back expiring contracts. They don’t want to get rid of him, but Donnie Walsh understands that Lee is the only player that he has that anyone else would want. You can’t get David Lee for scraps.
8 swilldog // Jul 3, 2008 at 6:14 am
Agreed on the 7th seed — that was my absolute ceiling for the team, and that’s assuming a massive improvement due to coaching, perfect health, and at least one other barely-playoff team collapsing.
I’d be delighted to see an 8th seed. But I’m assuming lotto team. Again.
9 Luke Uriniuk // Jul 3, 2008 at 10:03 am
If that trade were to happen then I’d rather the Bucks take on Curry contract, but I highly doubt that he would like coming off the bench which he would and so he’d probably become a distraction during Skiles first year. Not good.
However, the addition of David Lee, in my mind, is perhaps worth it. The question the Bucks would have to ask themselves before making that trade… is Lee the PF to team up with Bogut and build around in the future. If so, then the Curry problem could be dealt with. Though, how it all works out money wise I haven’t a clue.
10 smitty7789 // Jul 5, 2008 at 9:59 am
In regards to being a 7th seed, I would be extremly happy to be there. If we think about the future of the East, where ATL to Boston to 7 games as an eighth seed, I think about teams that might end up as a 2 seed next year. Boston, is favored to be the first seed, Detroit, no one really knows what will happen to them, Dumars seems to want to remake the team, one would have to assume they would not win as many games as they did last year. That leaves possibily Cleveland or Orlando as a 2 seed. Obviously we haven’t seen the Bucks or any of those team play yet with their new acquisitions, but on paper alone does anyone see those teams sweeping the Bucks in 4? IMO, I’m praying for Orlando to get the 2 seed if we were 7th because Rashard Lewis is their 4. This is all speculation obviously, but it’s interesting to think that it might not be that ill-conceieved to see the Bucks win a playoff series even if they are a 7th seed; hell, we saw Philadelphia push Detroit to the brink, I think they are a testament to the Bucks that if you play the right way, there is no reason the Bucks can’t use their talent to upset someone. Let’s just pray we make the playoffs, it would be a huge step.
11 Ben K // Jul 6, 2008 at 3:52 pm
There is no way in hell that Memphis would take on Mark Blount’s gigantic contract, no matter what they got in return. They wouldn’t deal Conley for just Charlie V and Dez either, why trade last years top 5 pick for cap space?
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